Kosherswitch:Falsely indicating that Rav Moshe Sternbuch endorses product-Shabbos- Mode appliances have the same switch.
A company selling grama switch for Shabbos is claiming an endorsement from Rav Moshe Sternbuch. HaGaon R’ Moishe Sternbuch shlit’aChief Rabbi/Ra'avad of the Eidah HaChareidis Yerushalayim. “Not gramma, better than gramma; Brocha that you should get the good to stay good, and get the bad to become good!” (1/5/2010 at his home)
I received the following letter from Rav Sternbuch's gabbai
I asked the Rav about this, he told me that he was asked about it, he wrote a letter via Rabbi Sigler on the issue, the Rav holds that it is not only chilul shaboss, but "akiras shaboss" to use this switch, the rav asked for his opinion to be publicized since he has been asked recently about this from numerous sources. Posted by Daas Torah at 7:55 PM
http://matzav.com/clients/matzav/Oven.pdf
It all started a number of years back on "Mesifta-Di'rakiah" [short-wave-radio]. Rabbi Moshe Heineman stated that on Shabbos in a Shul one may "ki'lachar-yad" turn on or off the alarm on shabbos.
Yudel Shain stated that he has a magnetic type switch that one can use for the alarm on Shabbos that would be permitted even according to the "Chazon-Ish". An individual asked on the program can one reverse omagnetic polarity on Shabbos....? Rabbi Heineman responded forget the magnetic type switch "the Chazon-Ish is only a DAAS-YOCHID", & do it ki'lacharyad. The STAR-K also utilizes the light-bulb to acomplish BISHUL-YISROEL.
Yudel Shain stated that he has a magnetic type switch that one can use for the alarm on Shabbos that would be permitted even according to the "Chazon-Ish". An individual asked on the program can one reverse omagnetic polarity on Shabbos....? Rabbi Heineman responded forget the magnetic type switch "the Chazon-Ish is only a DAAS-YOCHID", & do it ki'lacharyad. The STAR-K also utilizes the light-bulb to acomplish BISHUL-YISROEL.
Reb Shlomo Zalman's comment re: light-bulb Bishul yisroel.."one of the main causes of Intermarriage R"L."
Click on letter to enlage!
See Star-K link http://www.star-k.org/pdf/oventeshuva.pdf
And therefor you may even decide to use your computer on Yom-Tov without the screen, according to the Star-K.
The Shabbos mode appliances may not be so "shabbos friendly" after all.
Rav Shlomo Miller, Shlita [Toronto-Lakewood] recently publicized a letter re: Shabbos-mode ovens that one may not adjust temperatures on Yom-Tov, contrary to the kosher certification.
In respect to the above publicized letter from Rav Miller, we are not publicizing the name of the kosher certifier.
Others have researched the "Shabbos-friendly" appliances & concluded that according to ALL "Poiskim" it is not permitted to be used in the Shabbos mode. It is more than "Gramahs" that are being activated.
Rav Shlomo Miller, Shlita [Toronto-Lakewood] recently publicized a letter re: Shabbos-mode ovens that one may not adjust temperatures on Yom-Tov, contrary to the kosher certification.
In respect to the above publicized letter from Rav Miller, we are not publicizing the name of the kosher certifier.
Others have researched the "Shabbos-friendly" appliances & concluded that according to ALL "Poiskim" it is not permitted to be used in the Shabbos mode. It is more than "Gramahs" that are being activated.
See Star-K link http://www.star-k.org/pdf/oventeshuva.pdf
And therefor you may even decide to use your computer on Yom-Tov without the screen, according to the Star-K.
The SANHEDRIN would have taken up such a case in the context of a "zukun-mamrai".
116 comments:
This week's Kosher Today responds to two readers who criticized the publication for not disclosing the financial relationship between its editor, Menachem Lubinsky, and Agriprocessors and the Rubashkin family. This is after Lubinsky wrote an article defending Agriprocessors/Rubashkin's treatment of their workers:
"...and we remind two readers who contacted us about last week's Agri
story that both this publication and I do have a historical bias when
it comes to protecting the supply of kosher food, especially meat. I
have gladly represented them as a professional marketer in the past and
have the highest trust in our kashrus agencies and government agencies,
so nothing new there!"
KASHRUS INTEGRITY AT ITS BEST!
WHY ARE YOU SURPRISED THAT M. LUBINSKY, NAT LEWIN OR ANY OTHER ONE THAT IS IN THE BUSINESS OF GETTING COMPENSATED TO GET ON THE PULPIT AND ANOUNCE THE FOLLOWING $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ IN MY POCKET ETC.
ALL OF THE KOSHER CERTIFIERS ARE ALSO GETTING COMPENSATED, SOME PERHAPS ARE EVEN RECEIVING MORE THAN JUST FAIR COMPENSATION.
does L.A. have any reliable hechsher? thanx
Yudel you should publicly disassociate yourself from the rasha UOJ (aka mendlowitz) He posts on his site all the stories you bring to the public with the sole goal of bashing and ruining orthodox judaism and he makes it look like you posting it there. You should post a public disclaimer that you have nothing to do with that mechalel shabbos.
L.A. CAN'T GET THEIR ACT TOGETHER, IT'S TOO POLITICALLY CHARGED.
THERE ARE A FEW OLD TIMER CONTROLLERS THAT AREN'T BEING CHALLENGED.
EVEN THE YESHIVA LEIT DON'T HAVE ANYONE BACKING THEM FOR CHANGES IN KASHRUS.
WHAT A SHAME.
In my humble opinion, UOJ is trying to fix the corruption in orthodox judaism. His very rough & caustic tactics make it appear sometimes to the untrained eye that he is an enemy of Torah & mitzvos. I have seen limited examples in a couple of areas where his hashkofos are way off and his error (at least I hope he's not aware that he is crossing a red line) may venture into kefira. Afeelu hochi, he has a chelek in oylam habo for saving children from abuse. Almost no one else tried to help and the yechidei segula that did were not able to overpower the gangsters that enabled the abusers.
Rabbi Shain is an ish emess and I am optimistic that he can agree with this.
How is it that "a few" old time controllers run LA? They have many hashgochos over there.
Kashrus Magazine holds of RCC, KSA & Teichman, among others.
Does R' Yudel know something that the rest of us don't?
As far as the impersonations on UOJ's blog, they are pretty much harmless. Part of his shtick is the lighthearted impersonation of every publicly known figure.
Since that is his style and any reader can see it, it probably falls under the geder of there being no issur sheker where it's klor to everyone that it can't be true.
Maybe you can argue that it's at least sometimes laitzonus.
While I have no interest in whatever chovos UOJ may have, I envy his chelek for the tayerra neshomos of Yiddishe kinder that he was matzil.
R' TEICHMAN IS THE BIGGEST L.A. KASHRUS PROBLEM. MAY BE THEREFORE THE OTHERS MAY NOT WEILD ENOUGH POWER TO OVERCOME THE "VERY-WEAK" L.A. KASHRUS.
KASHRUS MAGAZINE IS IN BUSINESS TO PUBLISH & SELL HIS MAGAZINE, SO HE HAS TO TO WHAT IS POLITICALLY CORRECT.
FOR YOUR INFORMATION, KASHRUS MAGAZINE WILL NOT PUBLISH AN ARTICLE IF ANY OF THE MAJOR CERTIFIERS OBJECT TO IT.
MANY OF HIS KASHRUS ARTICLES RE: CATERERS, RESTAURANTS, PRODUCTS WILL HAVE ADS IN THAT ISSUE FROM THOSE MENTIONED-IT'S NOT A COINCEDENSE.
i think we should all go back to the Flintstone day thats the best.
I GUESS THE YESHIVA WORLD DOESN'T WANT TO POST RAV MILLER'S LETTER-GOTTA BE POLITCALY CORRECT!
Speak to R' Shmuel Berenbaum shlita. His driver named Eckstein is supposed to the mechaber of YeshivaWorld and the former Mirrer blog that was shut down after it ruffled too many feathers.
YeshivaWorld has a lot of nerve if he won't post R' Shlomo's letter after a different letter he put up that was completely dubious.
What I'm writing here is letoyeless to oppose the motzee shem ra that was nebich said about the mikva at Rav Halberstam's shul on the border of Flatlands / Marine Park, Brooklyn. R' Moishe Scheinerman passeled the mikva without even looking at it. R' Dovid Feinstein was then shlepped into the inyan by people with an agenda. R' Dovid was chozer after he found out he wasn't told the whole story. Rabbi Krauss from Kensington also put out a letter, the one posted by YeshivaWorld, that falsely said the mikva is not lechatchila.
Because motzee shem ra on a mikva is the worst type that causes tremendous agmus nefesh to the women who used it and their mishpochos, a rosh yeshiva organized an assifa of dozens of rabbonim to repudiate what Scheinerman & Krauss did.
YeshivaWorld still won't take down the letter.
Sounds Familiar. YeshivaWorld also put up a letter from Rabbi Belsky attacking the mashgiach from Le Marais - WITHOUT having spoken to him.
People were wondering what motivation Scheinerman had in badmouthing Rav Halberstam's mikva. It could be that it's altz competition because Scheinerman is expanding his shul to include a mikva and Rav Halberstam's is the only other mikva within reasonable walking distance.
This is Scheinerman who is in charge of Kehilla Kashrus, the same people who tried covering at first the treif on Ave J.
Some people, including kollel yungerleit, who rely on Rav Heinemann's kula to use microwaves for both milchigs & fleishigs, are dismissing R' Shlomo's letter, saying how do we know it's not forged like all the other kol korays out there?
"Politically Correct" is right.
YeshivaWorld would not allow ANY mention of the Torah Temimah affair. Not even that R' Shmuel Kamenetzky was interviewing victims from an unnamed yeshiva.
I would guess that Rav Heinemann & R' Shlomo were in Lakewood at the same time. Did R' Shlomo first try to get Rav Heinemann to retract?
Oh! c'mmon-I have no doubt that Reb Shlomo Miller spoke to Rav Moshe Heinemann about it.
Yeshiva world threatened me when I complained to him, that putting up the reason that the deal took so long for Yidden to use El Al was all because of what to do with the money that they gained for people losing their tickets.
I highly doubt it was true, but it was a tremendous Chillus Hashem anyways.
After that,I stopped reading that blog.
Reb Yudel,
R' Heinemann retaracted long ago. Why are you posting his original psak now?
the publisher of YW is really not a secret. It's hard to collect all those advertisements & remain anonymous. Even before he had ads, it was pretty well known who he was in certain circles. He's realy not controversial & doesn't really tackle any issues. 99% of his site is a copy & paste.
The credit goes to Reb Yudel who has no fear & states his views in a public forum, without hiding behind anonyminity.
check out this link which explains very simply why it is mutor http://www.star-k.org/pdf/oventeshuva.pdf
why is it that Hillel and Shammai were able to be cholek with out public fighting ,yet here we stand 100`s of years later and we literally have to cut throat at each other just so that you hold like me and not like the other pasak. I just dont get it.
Reb yudel u are entiled to hold your own psak but dont knock the other side .
I know for a fact that R' Heinemann and R' Miller have discussed this issue at length and on many occassions. I have been priviliged to witness some of these discussions. There is clearly a chilukei dayos between the two of them, and that's fine. They are both tremendous talmidei chachomim and, although they understand that eilu v'eilu divrei elokim chaim, try to convince each other,b'geder milchamto shel torah (instead of public bashing) that each one is right. But they continue to have the utmost respect for each other, which is the way it is supposed to be. If all machloksim in klall yisroel were like this machlokes, moshiach would be here already.
We & others have gone through it prior to Rav Miller's conclussion.
It's just plain one of those non-acceptable Heteirim, like the light-bulb theory that Reb shlomo Zalman OB"M told me that that is one of the causes of Intermarriage.
Bottom line it's Ossur.
What's R' Shlomo Zalman's vort on lightbulbs-intermarriage?
Yudel Shain said...
We & others have gone through it prior to Rav Miller's conclussion.
It's just plain one of those non-acceptable Heteirim, like the light-bulb theory that Reb shlomo Zalman OB"M told me that that is one of the causes of Intermarriage.
Bottom line it's Ossur.
Tue Apr 01, 01:02:00 PM 2008
=====================================yudel ,
who is *we*and *others* ?? name names as u usually do. Doo shems dach to mention who this we and others are.!!
We & others:?
Technical electronic experts.
GE Engineering was in touch with Yudel to design Shabbos-Mode for some of their appliances. Communication ended when Yudel wouldn't go allong with some of their designs that GE claimed "other Rabbis are comfortable with".
THE LIGHT-BULB THEORY:
(it's not a joke) A Heter goes this way- A Mashgiach hooks-up a battery operatd bulb in an oven-"we have bishul-Yisroel", it adds some heat-albeit no tikun in the AISH....The Sugas & Poiskim are ignored...
So it sounds like R' Shlomo Zalman holds that slacking off here on bishul akum causes intermarriage through a koychos hanefesh or metaphysical kind of oyfan. There is no introduction to a goy at that particular hotel or restaurant meal, but it can cause it somewhere else.
The Shabbos mode is good because the oven won't go off after 12 hours and won't ring or beep, even though you can Not change settings.
which sugas and poskim are ignored? Why is this worse that nishar chom bitanur?
Reb Shlomo zalman OB"M told me "you eliminate a bishul akum in New York, you'll eliminate an intermarriage in Paris".
Chazal say Wine & bishul-akum are the causes for intermarriage. reb Shlom zalman OB"M told me the americaner Rabonim think that there is a lack of proper education..., "it has nothing to do with education etc it's only due to the Heteirim on wine & bishul-akum".
You don't need the Shabbos-mode to shut off the 12 hour timer-they all have a by-pass for that by pushing 2 buttons at the same time etc.
"it's only due to the Heteirim on wine & bishul-akum".
Sounds like Belsky's heterim.
Don't forget that R' Zev Leff recently disputed him in public on coffee machines with treif flavorings.
Which hashgochos do and do not rely on the bulb farce? Are the hashgochos allowing it aware of R' Shlomo Zalman's vort?
Does R' Shlomo Zalman hold the bulb is no good even according to R' Chaim Ozer's shita that incandescent is aish and good enough for ner havdola?
Anonymous said...
Which hashgochos do and do not rely on the bulb farce? Are the hashgochos allowing it aware of R' Shlomo Zalman's vort?
The Star-K followers.
Even according to Reb Chaim Ozer OB"M it is unacceptable.
While we are talking about wine hetereim...SWEET & LOW contains cream of tarter which is a wine derivative & is Ossur. The fact that it's dried.... is not a Heter, as "afron" is also ossur by wine.
Tzum tzvetemul. Which sugas and poskim did they ignore, and why is this worse than nishar chom bitanur.
We've had this discussion before about cream of tartar.
R' Chanina Posner says he was told by R' Moishe that it's ok.
So is Star-K the only hashgocho using the bulb trick?
Is Rav Heinemann aware of what RSZ Auerbach zl said?
Meanwhile you've blamed it for intermarriage, made fun of it, and said its ignoring the sugyos and poskim. You still haven't said why. I asked a very simple and straightforward question twice and rather than give a real answer you chose to do nothing more than poke more fun. Do you have a real answer? Are your other issues such as Agriprocessors also nothing but poking fun?
To Mr. Tzum Dritten Mohl,
R' Yudel said the bulb gives off a token amount of heat which is laughable as far as starting the fire.
What is your difficulty exactly?
How about the heter from the chof k with a glow bar. Is that acceptable?
The glow bar question that was presented to Rav Eliyashev, Shlita-I don't think it was presented factually correct & the response is not being followed-in short it should not be relied upon.
zum tzvetemul. Which sugas and poskim did they ignore, all that address Intermarriage.
and why is this worse than nishar chom bitanur.What shaichus to nishar choimi? nishar choimi is from a proper bishul or pas yisroel...
Tzum firte mol. How is this different from the heat remaining in the oven the A FEW DAYS LATER? It is Biferush in Rama that it works. You can't start a fire from that. The whole thing is only a heker. The Gaon says this is better than kisam.
Are there any sugas or poskim not in Even Hoezer but in Yore Deah which they ignored? Nishar Chom is from only a fire that had a kissem thrown in. A splinter won't cook too much. If it fits with the halachos of bishul akum the halachos of intermarriage should be fine as well unless you say it is because of the spirit of the law.
Is your disagreement here the same as the one regarding using a phone to fire up equipment to make bishul yisroel which he holds is a gramma and you hold is not? Is the answer to that also in Even Hoezer?
It depends which phone system you are talking about.
The OU Remote-Bishul-Yisroel was designed in conjunction with Reb Shlomo Zalman OB"M, who was an expert in electric Halacha.
BTW, Reb shlom Zalman said that "it's is turning on the switch at the oven or boiler, you don't turn on the gas & take fire to light the flame"
The biggest questions are:
WHAT DOES THIS ALL SAY ABOUT THE STAR-K HECHSHER??? WHAT OTHER IDIOTIC HETERIM ARE BEING CONTRIVED BEHIND THE SCENES??? IS STAR-K JUST ANOTHER K???
This has much deeper ramifications than just a few ovens on Yom-Tov!!!
Real Talmidei Chachamim see in the Heinemann Teshuva a problem far more significant the ovens, vihamavin yavin...
R. Yudel:
IMPORTANT QUESTION!!! Do you know who designed that kitchen?? It's quite beautiful!
I don't follow this post at all. There is an audio link from Rabbi Heinemann where he discusses the objections of other Poskim, and he names Rabbi Miller. Rabbi Heinemann provides his explanation in response. I do not know what this "Gedolei" Haposkim is meant to imply --- that Rabbi Heinemann isn't entitled to issue his Psak, and until such time that someone convinces him that his arguments are wrong, that he can't express them? I have never asked Rabbi Heinemann a question in my life, but I'll surely defend his right to disagree with any Posek.
It is not sensible to disqualify his reasoning because you and others disagree with his approach to Bishul Akum. Let's assume that the Poskim are "right" on this and Rabbi Heinemann is not. Even those who have to bring a Par Helem Dovor Shel Tzibbur don't become disqualified from Paskening thereafter!
If I didn't know better, I'd suggest that this was an attempt to minimise Star-K's Posek and thereby Star-K because Rabbis Miller and Shternbuch and others disagreed with him on the Shabbos Oven.
When and if I can read a learned treatise which makes it clear that Rabbi Heinemann's Psak is demonstrably and unarguably incorrect, I might be inclined to ignore the Psak. I hasten to add that in such a case, so would Rabbi Heinemann!
RE: Isaac Balbin,
Yasher koach....
Ask Rav Yisroel Belsky "When does one get the status of a "zoken-mam'rai"?
He must be a big Talmud Chochom to start with....
Anonymous wrote: "When does one get the status of a "zoken-mam'rai"?"
On this basis, I guess every Da'as Yochid is in the category of a Zaken Mamrei. Perhaps the first step is to show that there is a Sanhedrin. Clearly there is not. There where many examples were Rav Shlomo Zalman was Moreh Heteirim in Hilchos Shabbos. No one would dare describe him with such a derogatory term. Was Rav Chaim Ozer also in that category when he decided that gelatin was kosher? Of course not. Were the people of Vilna who decided to follow the Psak of Rav Chaim Ozer guilty of "ignoring Daas Torah". Daas Torah is their Posek.
People talk about the width of the Pleytzes of the Posek. If this is an issue where some people contend that there is an ordered hierarchy of Poskim such that Rabbi Heinemann is at a lower level, then that is their personal view, even if it is held by their and other Kehillos. Clearly, Rabbi Heinemann is not considered some lower level Posek by his Talmidim and his Ba'alei Batim and those who ask him Shaylos and rely on his Psak. To ignore his followers is to create a new Daas Torah that assumes the role of a quasi Sanhedrin which delegitimises other views. This is an untenable position which foments Sinoh and subsequent Bizui Talmidei Chachomim.
It is grossly disingenuous at best and a chillul hashem at most to imply that Rabbi Heinemann in anyway follows the path of a Zoken Mamrai. This is Milchamto Shel Torah and is it is L'Shem Shomayim
Yes, If there would be Sanhdrin today & a Talmud Chochom of the highest caliber....Going against all other major poiskim....Would be a Zoken-Mamreh...
Would Rav Belsky fall under that banner also?.. perhaps!!!!
OH! we don't have Sanhedrin today, you are correct-I appologize.
Therefore in Theory I am correct, but due to the facts it can't be implemented...correct again..
Anonymous: Once more, following your logic you condemn a vast array of poskim who may be in the minority to the status of Zoken Mamre! You can't simply say that if not for a "technicality" that we don't have a Sanhedrin they would be in that category! Do you think for one minute that the re-institution of a Sanhedrin would be so benign as to continue to tie us to the current situation where politics and weltanshaung "determine" who is great(er) than the other?
The bottom line is that until such time as Moshiach comes you follow your Rav. People spend too much time telling us "mine is bigger than yours". Each to their own, people spend too much time looking in each other's windows when there are plenty of problems in their own houses.
To Isaac Balbin;
There are B"H only a limited few that are in that Matzav, where the Sanhedrin would have to declare the a Z"M.
It should not shake to the core the whole structure of PSAK.
Isaac Balbin misses various bottom lines himself including the following:
Bottom Line - Heinemann takes on establishments thrown out by other hashgochos for kashrus violations without even bothering to get the background.
Bottom Line - Heinemann's produce if full of insects
Bottom Line - Heinemann has been complicit in the cover up for child abusers. When someone finally tried doing something to stop the abuse in accord with the psak of gedolim, Heinemann hung a letter in the Agudah of Baltimore attacking the askan and calling him a kelev chozer al keeyo.
Doesn't sound like "Daas Torah" to me.
Anonymous: The fact that you don't provide your name and make the most serious allegations against a respected Rabbi, would suggest that the issue of defining someone else as a Zoken Mamre is hardly edifying.
It is folly to bring up the issue of abuse in the context of a Psak on Shabbos Mode appliances especially in light of the fact that a great many Rabonim who have been confronted with this new revealed scourge of sexual miscreancy are now developing and have developed guidelines and principles, including elaborating on the definition of Mesira. I don't expect for one minute that we are not witnessing a new found resolve to deal with the monsters who interfere with children.
I had cause to interact with Rav Heinemann on a matter recently, where the alleged was entirely innocent and the whole event shown to be a clear case of a mother with panic syndrome. If anything, I felt that Rav Heinemann was way too quick to condemn the alleged perpetrator.
I don't have any personal knowledge of insect infested products and your allegations in this regard, but if you have these, and can show them, then since you use the internet, I suggest you use your phone and video the evidence and bring it Rav Heinemann and ask him to respond to it. You might also ask his permission to write down his response or record it. You can upload your findings to youtube, hopefully using your full name, and then let people decide on what the Metzius is.
It is a sad day when people attempt to countermander a Psak whose rationale is available for all in the form of an mp3 through character assassination or through attempts to pull rank. If anything, I look forward to hearing or reading the rebuttal of those Poskim who disagree with the arguments in Rav Heinemann's mp3. Torah Hi. I'm really not interested in the petty politics which may be inhibiting Bias Goel.
Yes, Rabbi Heinemann has also acted on some abuse incidents. It depends how much protekzia the perpetrator has.
Rabbi Heinemann was condemned in a kol korei by some 50 or 60 rabbonim after he took on Fresh Express romaine lettuce. Even Gornish and the other usual suspects were forced to drop Fresh Express because the sheer number of insects was embarrassing even for them. That created an opportunity for Heinemann to jump in and $$$ grab $$$ the account.
Anonymous:
I suggest you use your phone and video the evidence and bring it Rav Heinemann and ask him to respond to it. You might also ask his permission to write down his response or record it. You can upload your findings to youtube, hopefully using your full name, and then let people decide on what the Metzius is.
I have reliable information that rabbonim have spoken to Rabbi Heinemann and do not understand his "logic". R' Moishe Feinstein said based on a Gemora - in a bedieved sense - that gantz Klal Yisroel cannot be nichshol in something BUT if a problem is found it must be fixed. Heinemann uses this as a lechatchila for bugs in lettuce, that it couldn't really have been so bad all the years even if there is infestation, but omits the part about making a fix. This is certainly not R' Moishe's shita.
Rabbonim also tell me that Star-K Northeast under the Lakewood Heinemann brother is worst of all. They told the oylam not to eat at Cafe K because they know that Star-K did not bother to find out why the restaurant was thrown out by a hashgocho known for very high tolerance of kashrus violations.
Rabbi Belsky uses the same "logic" about the Klal not being nichshol in refusing to even listen to new evidence about copepods in the water.
Anonymous: My recollection of Reb Moshe's attitude in respect of a) things which are not easily seen with the naked eye, and b) things which were not assured by Poskim of the previous generation is that he was clearly against making such things Ossur. I believe that Rav Heinemann quotes a Mishna Brura (from memory?) to the effect that even if you can see the item, but can't tell that it's a sheretz with the naked eye, then it's also not ossur.
I'm in Melbourne, and I can't comment on the Metzius in your locale in respect of the size of the creatures in your infestation.
In respect of why Kashrus was removed by one Hashgocho and added by another: this happens all around the world. Unless you know the owner is a Rosho U'Merusho who wantonly subverts the kashrus, surely you'd institute your standards and monitor them. Perhaps the loss of one hechsher even caused a rethink by the proprieter to the extent that he doesn't want to make the same mistake again. I'm hypothesizing and I'd suggest that's what most people would be doing.
R' Moishe holds that if you can see something unidentified and only a magnifier shows the wings / legs, it is still assur min Hatorah.
Where does the Mishna Brura discuss bug sizes?
You say most but not all poskim are against the Shabbos mode technology. Which yechidim among the poskim is R' Heinemann going with?
Rabbi Shain,
How much is Steve Reinman getting paid? Is he getting a few jobs together?
The explanation of Rav Miller is not convincing. The motion changes one magnetic bit which R. Heineman describes is analogus to a microbe which is not a metzius. From that point the computer takes over and bderech geromoh and even though it is a pesik reshe it still qualifies as a geram melochoh because of the delay.
The hachrozoh shows no explanation. A computer has a complete encoded writing which can be dislayed. This is a complete transcription. All that is domne wirth the oven is generate a signal wich has no meaning yet.
Sorry. But, there seems to be a good semach. BTW this bit is done by a recognition that something was moved. It is action at a distance.
Reb yudel,
Let me discuss your writing on a computer without a screen. In that case the whole message is complete. In our case the signal causes the "message" to be generated and then that has to be acted on. If one wrote on a computer and could not hook up a printer then explain the issur. it is just a bunch of microscopic bits. This is our case. The bit has no value. It CAUSES (geram) the generation of bits which then can turn on the oven. It would be comparable to sendinga signal taht a computer should write the declaration of indpendence.
I will not approve on it. I regard as nice post. Especially the appellation attracted me to review the sound story.
It seems to me it is good idea. I agree with you.
Rav Heinemann of all people is the kal? You would think not because he is a talmid of R' Aron Kotler who was a big machmir in thermostats.
We know someone from Flatbush who was in Queens for a recent Shabbos. The Mrs. attended a women's shiur from a Queens Vaad shul on Shabbos afternoon.
One woman from this VHQ shul remarked that at the past week's RCA convention, the modern orthodox rabbis voted that Avi Weiss's pritzas geder of ordaining women rabbis cannot be orthodox by definition. A bunch of women at this shiur immediately snarled up their faces and angrily intoned that RCA rabbis have no business telling women what to do and that they want to see women ordained as rabbis. The heimishe lady guest made a mental note that 60% of the women in attendance - more than half - were angry at the RCA for sticking up for Torah umitzvos.
This shul is not even as Left wing as some Queens Vaad shuls get.
This fits perfectly with what a rosh yeshiva has been shotzing up the Queens Vaad. He taynas that many of their constituents are so far to the Left that they would angered if the Queens Vaad makes any real attempt to bring kashrus standards up to something acceptable and that the Vaad will therefore make sure not to get them upset.
Will this affect the percentage of DA cows?
http://www.recordonline.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20100718/BIZ/7180307/-1/NEWS
The low price of milk is making it difficult for farmers to make ends meet, and many are trading in their dairy heifers for beef cattle.
"That's the first thing they fall back on once they get out of the dairy business," Sweetman said. "This way they can still keep their farms in operation and try to make a living subsidizing their income."
Local beef prices range from $3 a pound for ground beef to as much as $20 a pound for organic free-range beef, Reith said.
Pssst. Did you hear that someone at the Queens Vaad is trying to sell the Brooklyn Bridge? More specifically, it is the guy making a nice salary to be in charge of kashrus but was instead caught spending his days attacking people and using nivul peh on this website. Because that wouldn't go over very well with the public, he is now spreading a rumor that it's not him, it's one of his friends from Boston.
Why still would he give his imaginary "friend" the content of the emails that were sent to JBAC to be posted here?
How much are you selling the bridge for again?
Here's what is posted at the bagel store in Great Neck next to the VHQ teudas kashrus.
http://www.panys.org/alerts/264.htm
This same invitation in the 8th item down:
"Thursday, August 5, 7:30 p.m.
MANHASSET. Unitarian Universalist Congregation at Shelter Rock, 48 Shelter Rock Rd.
NO NUKES, NO WARS, SAVE THE PLANET!
Hear David Wildman, Executive Director, Human Rights & Racial Justice for Global Ministries, Methodist Church, and co-author, Ending the U.S. War in Afghanistan; Rev. Mark Luken, Bethany Congregational Church; Rabbi Irwin Huberman, Congregation Tiferet Israel (Conservative) of Glen Cove; Habeeb Ahmed, President, Islamic Center Mosque of L.I. at Westbury"
Wow that's really in the spirit of Tisha B'Av to get together with a bunch of galochim, Arabs and kofrim at a Church nuch dem!
And what kind of "peace" group is this? As mentioned on the same web page, they are holding a protest march in Manhattan against the government for convicting Lynn Stewart of providing support to al Qaeda. She is the radical Leftist lawyer who was helping send messages from her convicted terrorist client in jail.
The Tzadiekes from Flatbush (yeh, another rightist yeshivish area???) comes to Queens and makes "mental" notes about the so called leftist. Harabanit also 'shotzes up' what these so called rosh hayeshivah ...blah blah...
Of course all this adds up to Kashrus. It seems that those so called rosh hayeshivahs must have some info on how R. Avi Weiss must have trained his maharat that leftist &/or Queens people are exempt from Kosher laws
Is there a Star K teshuva for this?
http://www.courthousenews.com/2010/07/19/CCA.pdf
LG Electronics makes a refrigerator with French doors whose light stays on when it's closed, warming up the inside, spoiling food, melting and burning parts and creating a fire hazard, a class action claims in Newark Federal Court.
It makes perfect sense to me that women supporting Rabbahs are not interested in having checked lettuce and mashgiach temidi on stores with not so frum baalim.
I told you so!
Here he goes with his 'perfect' logic!
Feivish must be on the spotlight list of anonymous identities
Notice:
please do NOT walk in to any VHQ store. According to Spotlight and co. you will get molested, robbed and kidnapped since this is the VHQ policy.
http://www.thejewishweek.com/editorial_opinion/letters/speaking_out_abuse_victims
Speaking Out For Abuse Victims
Tuesday, July 20, 2010
Judith S.B. Guedalia
Regarding “Accused Pedophile To Resign From Queens Rabbinical Board” ...
The argument in the teshuvah written by R. Heinemann is that the signal is microscopic - a bit is changed. Microscopic is a non entity.
Also, this bit is changed also by the computer seeing a different mechanical setting which has heterim. A sensor detects a break betwen two points caused by a physical object placed in between. A program detects this and then sets the bit. It is once removed and is muter with menias hamoneah which is a heter used by R. Halperin of the technical institute. This heter is basd on the SA Horav.
All this has nothing to do with graphics that R. Shain mentions. That is typed in directly.
I suggest you read the teshuvos of Rav Halperin of the technical institute. Actually, many rabonim are against the institute, but, rav Halperin is reliable.
There are alarm systems that are muter and the shabos mode is based on the same technology. As I said, the person causes a piece of metal to cross in the line of a sensor and what ir senses. the computer notices this and sets a bit. This is a geram and the bit is microscopic. After a delay the second step takes place.
I spoke to r. Heineman's representative and indeed this is what is going on. Rav Miller's response ingnores all this.
As far as the bulb is concerned many rely on a piece of wood in a fire that does nothing. This is his hetter. Neither do anything BTW thte OU criticizes but use his sevoroh modified. I saw a teshuvah of theirs.
The piece of wood maken a tikun in the "aish", The bulb is just like sticking your hand in & adding body temperature. BTW- reb Shlomo Zalman Z"L said that one of the causes of intermarriage is the "amerikaner heter" of the light bulb.
Re: The rest Poskei eretz yisroel & Reb Shlomo Miller among others have taken everything relevant into account.
The tikun in the aish is not measurable. The bulb from afar gives as much heta and energy as thta little stick-gor nicht. It is called a sevoroh. Take it or leave it.
But, let us stick to the shabos mode. I spoke to R. heineman's rep who explained it. It took a few rounds and R. Heineman was consulted a few time sto clarify. What i described is how it works. The circuit has three parts. The sensor, the thing sensed and space. When you stick something in the space something happens. The sensor cannot see the thing it senses. This is not like a curcuit made of wires. I know that R. Miller has no inckling to what I write. The teshuvah of R. heineman leaves this out.
From Rav Miller's statements it is clear that he is not addressing what I bring out.
We can never know what is taken into account unless people write the total sheeloh up. Most modern teshuvot do not. Some of what R. Elyashiv said showed that. The main problem is they do not like geram or menias hamoneah. Rav Karelitz says teh same thing about teh institute in his hilchos dshabos shiurim.
The ikor machooh against against the shabos mode is the same as waht they say against the institute. Thye would like that also closed. You know that. What you need is someone who accepts the institute's pesokim to find holes.
Rav Miller wrote R. heineman a letter and what he brought was answered. This point is NOT dcscussed. R. Heineman does not write it in his teshuvah. Ask Rav Miller to repond to what I am describing. That includes some of R. Halpern's alarm setups.
It is possible that I misunderstood since there was a person in between him and me.
But, what is wrong with what I described?
Let's forget the other items re: the Gramahs of the friges & the stoves.
We have a very serious issue with heteirim that are causing intermarriage R"L.
Measurable is not the criterea, a tikun in the aish is the criterea. Learn the Sugyas.
Why in the world would Rav Heinemann leave out an integral part from a teshuva he uses to defend himself? Even Rav Belsky makes more sense than this when he refuses to write teshuvos at all.
You say learn the sugyos. Let us both do that. It is a good idea. Who says it has to be direct. If the effect is the same the same tikun has taken place. This is called sevoroh and we cannot get guidance from the sugya itself.
Intermariage depends on whether it is assur. If you hold it is asser then it can cause it. if not then we must look elsewhere.
Rubashkin's meat did not help and that was obvious. Why look for needles in hay stacks.
But, let us get Rav Miller to talk to R. heineman and address my point if I have it straight. I think I do. The microscopic is written but the signal is not put in directly like your graphics example.
.
I saw R. Elyashiv's original machooh on the shabos stove. he said that a circuit was broken which is incorrect unless you consider air and space as a circuit. Scientists do but not halachists.
I belive the machooh extends to Rav Halperin and company. Sorry, but, evne Rav Auerbach supported them.
Reb Yudel. What do think of Zomat?
BTW Could you desscribe the magnetic alarm that you mentioned? There must be a circuit and electricity to make an alarm work.
Anonymous - 1 asked,
"Why in the world would Rav Heinemann leave out an integral part from a teshuva he uses to defend himself?"
I wish I knew the answer to this. I think that a lot of people hold back so that you can't opshlog them.
I recall saying to the rep in the star-k I spoke to (and it was a few times) that no circuit was broken or made as Rav Elyashiv claimed unless you consider people, objects, and/or air space as part of a circuit. We want wires.
I also recall asking him how it was done and he told me I need to call the technicians. But, I did talk to a physicist and he called it action at a distance like gravity and said it was easy to make.
But, if you doubt me call teh star-k and I guarantee you that when you get the rep he will be glad (if you do not attack him) to go over it with you If you hear something differenrt I will call back to reverify.
I do recall also talking about the issur or heter on resetting a clock forward and backward on yom tov. For example, if the stove had just shut off the fire and you made it lower you would cause the fire to go on later - a delay and you can also make it come on earlier. THere is a machalkes haposkim on all of this and Rav Heinaman needs this kulah to allow the shabos mode. This is also choser min hasefer and no one picked up on it.
Rav Miller addresesed what he understood. For Rav Heineman the ikor chidush was teh signal that he felt was not a problem because it was a computer bit and miscroscopic.
Anonymous - 2
In general I do not like to attack Rabonim and there pesokim. The fact that others dsagree is not enough reason to hurt a Rov. If you disagree or are not sure then don't accept it.
But, unles you are on Rav heineman's level it pays to be careful. After all, there are 70 ponim latorah and we do not have a Sanhedrin. So, if you are not then pick your Rov otherwise write a teshuvah. Rav Miller wrote with derech eretz. Why not bloggers.
But, I still want to know about the magnetic alarm of the Chazon Ish. it sounds like action at a distance story.
Anonymous - 2
Rav Miller calls the signal created makeh bepatish. What he means to say is that a full act has already completed. This is true because later on it can be used. hence, it is equivalent to a full long text. Thus, he disagrees that the microscopic helps us. (Not clear why not)
But, this is done as I said through a geram and thus the melochoh if it is should be muter.
This is how I believe Rav Heineman would explain it.
To review. What I see is that the issue of the shabos mode is whether generating a microscopic signal is a melochocho. Rav heineman says it is not. But, I think Rabbi Shain is 100% correct then why not write on a computer without a screen. This point is also made by Rav Miller. In this I would tend to be machmir. A full message is also a few microscopic bits. And, a technician can find it using his scopes. It is not really invisible.
But, we have the fact that the signal is created also by a geram. Sadly, Rav Heineman does not put this point in writing. I think my report of what I heard from the star-k should be verified. Maybe, I misunderstood. After all, not I nor the rep are electronic people and maybe something got muddled. He did compare it a recording on a tape and this is asser.
Maybe, Rav Shain could call up and talk it over. The technicians should be consulted.
I spoke with the star-k rep again.
I asked him how it differed from a key typed in without a screen. He said it did not. The point that R. Heineman made was that there can be no melocho deoraysoh (maybe uvdah dechol) since you cannot get at it without further processing.
The issue is whether a message is makeh bepatish or not since it is not a complete thing until it is received. The receiver is indirect.
Let us study the gedorim of makeh bepatish before commenting. I do recall finishing a part completely is also makoh bepatish even though the whole is not. But, here it is invisible.
According to his cheshbon typing into a computer with the screen off is muter mideoraysoh. probably also putting things on a tape recorder.
I suspect that R Heinman would say just that. He would agree with R. Shain. It is all one and the same. As I said, calling it makeh bepatish is a sevoroh. I have to learn more before being machriah.
I will repeat. From R. Elyahivs comments that he is tampering with a circuit we see that he does not understand the issue.
Rav Miller does but it breaks down into a sevoroh. The question is whether a message that is poel nothing yet and is invisible is a melochoh.
I have a sefer from Rav Lev from the mochon I will look him up for guidance. They surely discuss these kinds of issues.
I looked through R. lev's sefer and to be honest the issues are not that simple. To find melochos deoraysos on many of the actions of a computer are difficult.
What you asked about tape recorders or typing without a screen is well taken. (even a screen may not be a deoraysoh - the letters are broken and not kayomoh) but, they are assur because of udah dechol.
Our case, is an oven which is not uvdoh dechol on yom tov. Hence, making a claim that it is makeh bepatish when it is invisible and there is a geram is difficult. It is also not a kayomoh so it cannot be deoraysoh. I would like PROOF rather than pronouncments. Feelings do not fly.
Of course, geram on Yom Tov is also a big issue. R. Heineman relies on the mishne berurah but many big poskim such as the Avenei Nezer and others do not allow this without a hefsed. But, a heter it is.
So, I think we must not attack or use other talmide chachomim to attack rabonim. You don't like it or are afraid then be machmir. But, unless you know first hand as a talmid chochom that R. Heineman is wrong then it pays to tred lighter. I can't disprove R. Heineman. Can you R. Shain.
I will admit that my original confusion came from talking to the star-k rep. I had the same difficulties when I talk the OU's.
It would be better to talk to R. Heineman, but, I was told that his wife will not let anyone bother him on this sheeloh anymore. He has heard everyone's complaint and believes he is correct.
I have no way to go further. I challenge R. Shain to provide PROOF.
Maybe, Rav Miller could write a teshuvah to rebut R. Heineman formally. R. Heineman has a letter from him. H. Heineman addressed the issues (an audo is available.) He did not mention makoh bepatsh nor did he discuss the fact it was microscopic. Was any of this in the letter from Rav Miller?
Lets remember that what you say is also a daas yachid.
You may be right but a daas yachid nevertheless.
What does R' Yudel say about the fleish under Rav Feigelstock in Argentina? There is only one or two places in NY where you can buy this meat.
Yudel: Can you please post the original Kol Korei, with the signatures of the Gedolei Eretz Yisroel?
I guess my wife and my family will be mechala shabbos. The Chumras are really getting out of hand while some rabbonim are making a good living.
B"H ,the only one we answer to, He understands and He is
compasionate - and forgiving.
8:58 pm, that's the dumbest thing I've heard in a long time. Talk about the blind being led ...
Rabbi Heinemann owns the Star-K, which is a for-profit organization. He makes a LOT of money when his organization gets involved with issuing Heterim on Kashrus, appliances or anything else.
How can we blindly trust what he says when he has a financial interest in its outcome?
Tell me of 1 kashrus organization that
no one is making some $$$ from its fees.
'Daas torah' site is another INTERNET site. The question is just who is more treif.
Lofty bye, sentimental soul mate :)
R' Chaim Oizer in Achiezer says shooting the cow in the head after shechita is only mutter bishaas hadchak mamash like when the anti-Semitic Nazi government in Finland assered shechita without it. (They later assered shechita in gantzen). So how do the OU & Rav Weissmandl allow it lechatchila?
http://daattorah.blogspot.com is a FRAUD.
The site gives the impression that Rav Shternbuch Shlit'a approves everything he says when in truth he MAYBE asks him a few things and everything else he says Rav Shternbuch TRUSTS him.
Just go to the site and see for yourself.There is no doubt that the man is trying to lead the world by their ignorance.
Rabbi Eidensohn did a lot of good work exposing the frauds from Leib Tropper, Seth Farber & the modern orthodox group Shavei Israel but he clearly has an unjust agenda against gerei tzedek.
The Wall St Journal reported yesterday that there are species of Pacific tuna that spawn off Japan before swimming to the US coast who have been found with dangerous levels of radioactive cesium in their flesh. This is presumably from the Fukushima nuclear reactor meltdown following last year's earthquake & tsunami. It's a shame that one of few food fish not affected by anisakis have a different problem.
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