There is a recent new company with pre-washed vegetables "Kleen farm". They use market produce "not green-house" grown. They do a washing under the supervision of a mashgiach, who checks a relatively small amount of samples to ascertain if the washing is working.Kleen Farm may be the solution to the many if not most foodservice establishments that don't have trained expert mashgichim for checking infestation. It just doesn't compare to the trained expert on site mashgiach or to the positive system which starts with green house grown product.
Numerous food service establishments that have been using the greenhouse grown & superior inspection " Positive" brand have recently opted (or were instructed) to use the kleen-farm brand. Prior to using a food service establishment ascertain what they are using in their menu.
33 comments:
r yudel how good do you know this company that youre makeing comments?
r yudel how good do youknow this company that youre makeing statments. (They do a washing under the supervision of a mashgiach, who checks a relatively small amount of samples to ascertain if the washing is working).
Have you forgotten that this company is owned by Woodmere's George Gross from the Negev catering kashrus scandal? After being thrown out by both the Flatbush Vaad & Rav Mendelson he got Babad's sign in his Ave J storefront window with no questions asked by Babad. Babad also has Clinton's "Don't Ask don't tell" policy and ignored a subsequent warning letter from the Flatbush Vaad.
This was the makka bepatish that prompted KIC to corner & force Babad (as well as Gornish once they were at it) to sign a pledge that he cannot take accounts thrown out by other hashgochos for kashrus violation.
Reb yudel don't you understand that most people just womt to eat on somebody elses achrais the avrige rov hamachshir dosnt know the mitsiyas forget about the halacha.
A few years ago there was a fan of George Gross telling people that Gross is getting patents for foolproof methods to remove thrips from strawberries and leaf miners from the middle of romaine.
Yudel, does sound like pure fantasy unless someone has money behind them like a Monsanto or the Pentagon's research lab?
The ultra sonic method was a great idea in theory but did not work in fact-Sorry!
Rabbi Eisen basically had to check out Gross's product because of pressure from the local shul rabbi and the OU. The packages he checked were of regular product and were clean. I don't think he was "sold" on the breakthrough predictions for thrips and leaf miners and here we are that Gross never delivered on the hype he created.
A number of scientific journals have either panned ultrasonic pest control or said that any effectiveness is inconclusive.
http://www.ftc.gov/opa/2003/07/global.shtm
The Federal Trade Commission sent 2 consent warnings to an ultrasonic device maker for making unsubstantiated claims that the sound waves repel insects, etc. Each consent warning is up to an $11,000 fine until the company complies with the government to stop the false advertising.
Is George going to come on the blog and blame "Goldberg" for manipulating the FTC?
All I can tell you all is that I'm a certified mashgiach and I have checked most of kleen farms approved products and it passed. He is not relying on the ultrasonic itself in the passed eight months kleen farms has improved in all aspects. You won't do any good by knocking him down. It's a real ziki hrabim.
George could have broiled the livers at Negev catering ultrasonically instead of having an unsupervised goy doing it!
Certified mashgiach? certified by whom? Defintly not certified for bedikas toloiyim. So the fact you checked leaves a question. Kleen farms is definly a big zikui harabim. But you don't stop using a positive product or a bodek cabage & replacing it with kleen farm.
anonymous aka goldberg
How often did your wife buy the liver at negev?
stop the cruel defamation!
nuno
yudel ?
good idea!
Yudel, Does Postiv have bugs before it is washed ? YES
is Bodek green house grown? NO
Why is that ?
I'm certified in bdikas toloiyim by a few well known toloiyim professionals. R yudel I can arrange you going to kleen farms with any professional you choose.
Positive does not have herbs.
Yudel, your last post says "you dont stop using Bodek or Postiv."
Did anyone assur them ? Did anyone say they are no longer approved ? NO.
What was said is that Mashgiachim are no longer permitted to wash / check herbs. The only source currently permitted is KLEEN FARMS.
Instead of all the motzei Shame Rah you are causing here I suggest you reach out to them and see for yourself.
BTW who certified you as a bodek bitiloyim ?
Is Bodek Green House grown ?
NO !
What happens to Positive Romaine if it found to have any bugs during pre wash?
If it is then washed and rechecked why would it be any different than Kleen Farms whose process is using standard market product, pre checked , washed then checked post wash by a qualified mashgiach?
Does a probable 25% saving on the coat of the product mean anything ?
Perhaps that is why many are nervous
The vaad of flatbush does not allow it in their establishments. Kehila does allow it. what happens at co-certifed establishments? I guess then they are going to have to get a real mashgiach
Where in Flatbush is the Vaad of Goldberg the sole hashgocha? NO WHERE ! why is that?
Flatbush Vaad does have the sole supervision in many places.
There are legitimate reasons why they often co-certify.
Sometimes a chassidishe hashgocho is required for marketing to the BP crowd.
Sometimes Kehillah is along for the ride. This predates Rabbi Goldberg from the old days when the Vaad was seen as corrupt & unreliable.
VHF is still unreliable and corruptable. Look who is in charge there. can you give an example of 5 establishments other than Morrel caterers where the vaad is sole hashgocha ?
Who other than Goldberg jr are field mashgiachs ?
George....
Taitelbaum from the Mir and Mandel from Torah Vodas there are others whose names I don't know. Wiener from KIC speaks about them in glowing terms
Still no response as to who other than Morrell is exclusivly under the VHF. Why is that.
Why no reponse as to who other than the Goldberg family is on the Vaad ? Surely a list of VRabbonim affiliated with the VHF should be made public. Why avoid the issue unless its all a one man operation.
If that is the case what gives you the right to call yourself the Vaad of Flatbush. VHQ has many Rabbonim affiliated with them, and their names are readily available.
Why have no tax returns been filed with NYS?
George, nice try
Flatbush Vaad as only hashgocho
Back to Nature
Shang Chai
Hunan
Original Brooklyn Bagel
Kosher Haven (Brooklyn College)
Burgers Bar
Cafe Spoons - Boro Park
Dagan Pizza - Mill Basin
David's Restaurant
Empire Grill - Mill Basin
Gourmet on J
Kosher Pizza Plus
Moshe's Pizza
Natural Village Cafe
Pizza Cardo
Pizza Nosh
Mr. Nosh
Estihana
Schnitzel Express - Manhattan
Probably more
Flatbush Vaad as only hashgocha
FACTS !!!
Back to Nature
Shang Chai
Hunan RABBI GORNISH
Original Brooklyn Bagel
Kosher Haven (Brooklyn College)
Burgers Bar KK
Cafe Spoons - Boro Park Rav Amnon Ross NOT VHF
Dagan Pizza - Mill Basin NOT in FLATBUSH
David's Restaurant
Empire Grill - Mill Basin NOT in FLATBUSH
Gourmet on J KK
Kosher Pizza Plus
Moshe's Pizza out of business
Natural Village Café NYC
Pizza Cardo
Pizza Nosh OK
Mr. Nosh NOT VHF R’ BABAD
Estihana BROOKLYN ? NOT SOLE HASHGOCHA
Schnitzel Express - Manhattan
Probably more. What does that mean?
Strange, that so many are out of Flatbush. Why is that? Is it a credibility issue?
Why do you refuse to name the Rabbonim that are on the Vaad ?
Flatbush Vaad as only hashgocha
FACTS !!! (some of them switched or were hounded out of Flatbush Vaad)
Back to Nature
Shang Chai
Hunan RABBI GORNISH (Is that the place owned by goyim that was grandfathered from the old days? Rabbi Goldberg couldn't kick them out no matter how many complaints he got unless he caught something red handed. They would be a good fit for Gornish and cheapo fee)
Original Brooklyn Bagel
Kosher Haven (Brooklyn College)
Burgers Bar KK (Rabbi Goldberg was on their case for a very bad Health Dept inspection with 26 violations. Kehillah only cares about collecting their check)
Cafe Spoons - Boro Park Rav Amnon Ross NOT VHF
Dagan Pizza - Mill Basin NOT in FLATBUSH
David's Restaurant
Empire Grill - Mill Basin NOT in FLATBUSH
Gourmet on J KK
Kosher Pizza Plus
Moshe's Pizza out of business
Natural Village Café NYC
Pizza Cardo
Pizza Nosh OK
Mr. Nosh NOT VHF R’ BABAD
Estihana BROOKLYN ? NOT SOLE HASHGOCHA (That's true on Ave J but on Upper West Side the Flatbush Vaad is sole hashgocho)
Schnitzel Express - Manhattan
Probably more. What does that mean?
Strange, that so many are out of Flatbush
Nice try George. Mill Basin is a natural extension of Flatbush as young couples are priced out of East 20s & East 30s. Who cares if it's Ave N & East 50s?
Probably more. What does that mean?
Strange, that so many are out of Flatbush. Why is that? Is it a credibility issue?
ARE YOU REPRESENTATIVE OF THE COMMUNITY ?
DOESN'T SEEM THAT WAY IF RABBI GORNISH HAS 5 TIMES THE AMOUNT OF ESTABLISHMENTS AS THE VHF.
Why do you still refuse to name the Rabbonim that are on the Vaad ?
Are you kidding about Gornish? He has 5 times the places because he is the cheapest & easiest. He pays his mashgichim the least and as the saying goes when you pay peanuts, you get ...
Whoever wants Gornish is choshud.
And give it a rest already with the dual certifications. Many places have Kehilla from the old days of Flatbush Vaad, predating the arrival of Rabbi Goldberg. The biggest Vaad critics of old have said that Rabbi G really cleaned house.
Cleaned house or just took over to give his son a job ?
What shul is Rabbi Goldberg affiliated with? Does he even have a Kehilla ?
Most Rabbinim in kashrus have a shul does rabbi Goldberg ?
Still no answer as to what Rabbonim or shuls the VHF represents.
It happens all the time that a group of rabbis hire a kashrus administrator. That's what Kehillah did with Zecharya Adler. That's what KIC did with Rabbi Weiner. That's what the Lakewood Vaad did, etc
You're grabbing at straws
enough of the mishugas.
why doesn't VHF just answer this persons questions?
from what I see here the list of sole hasgocha is relativly short.
some of the stabl;ishments listed are not VHF stores.
No names of shuls or Rabbonim are given?
Why the secrecy?
Rabbi Beck ,Rabbi Gornish and Rabbi Babad all have kehilos.
Where is Rabbi Goldberg's?
These simple questions have been asked by multiple posters.
GIVE AND ANSWER AND PERHAPS THIS WILL ALL GO AWAY
Why all this banter.
Why doesnt the poster answer the questions already?
Put this nonsense to rest.
1 What Rabbonim are members of the VHF ?
2 What shul is Rabbi Goldberg affiliated with, most Rav hamachshirim do, Rabbi Katz (Margarov) Rabbi Gornish,Rabbi Beck and Rabbi Babad to name a few.
Why does a local Hashgocha in such a large community have so few stores as a sole hashgocha?
Who does the VHF represent ?
When did the Vaad Harabonim of Flatbush become the Vaad Hakashrus of Flatbush ?
Why the change?
Is it because it is now a private business and have no affiliation to any shuls or Rabbinim from the community ?
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