Sunday, January 16, 2022

Update: Rebb Moshe Feinstein

בדבר חלב הקאמפאניעס אף שיש טעמים להקל ודאי שהוא רק במקום שליכא חלב ישראל שהוא תחת השגחת רבנים יראי ה’ אבל במקום שאיכא חלב ישראל שהוא בהשגחה וכדומה כל עניני חלב צריך להחמיר וכל שכן אלו שבבתיהם נזהרין לאכול רק מחלב ישראל שבהשגחה צריכין להזהר שהוא גם מחשש ענין נדרים, וממילא גם בהאספיטעלער המתנהגים במאכלי כשר שיש להם לתקן מה שאפשר להם בזה להשיג מאכלי חלב שבהשגחה כי בפה נוא יארק ליכא בזה שום דוחק.  ולכל הפחות ישיגו מאכלי חלב שבהשגחה לאלו שנזהרין בזה בבתיהם ולא לכוף אותם חס ושלום שיאכלו שם מה שנזהרים שלא לאכול.

נאום משה פיינשטיין

 

This article was written l’zecher Nishmas the author’s father-in-law, Rabbi Yaakov Hirsch z”l, whose 16th yahrtzeit is this evening the 23rd of Shvat.

Recently, an askan passed away and in his private papers – a letter from Rav Moshe Feinstein zt”l was found.  The letter was brought to light by Rabbi Chaim Dalfin of Borough Park. It seems that the askan had asked one of the Jewish hospitals as to why they did not provide Cholov Yisroel dairy meals to their patients.

The hospital administrator replied that they relied upon the leniency of Rav Moshe zt”l.  The Askan asked Rav Moshe directly about whether New York hospitals should be lenient and the following responsum was his reply:

Oct. 23, 1963,

Regarding the matter of milk from companies, even though there are reasons to be lenient, certainly these [leniencies] are only for a place where there is no cholov Yisroel available that is under G-d-fearing Rabbis.  But in a place where cholov Yisroel under supervision and the like is available all matter regarding milk one must be stringent.  Certainly, for those who in their homes are careful to only eat supervised cholov Yisroel, we must be careful – for it is also a concern of violating an oath.  It comes out that also in a kosher hospital where they serve only kosher – they should enact whatever is possible to obtain dairy items that are supervised [cholov Yisroel], for here in New York, there is no difficulty [in obtaining it].  At the very least they should obtain supervised milk for those that are careful in it in their homes and not to force them, Heaven forbid, to consume there what they are careful not to eat.

20 comments:

  1. Ah, so you're agenda is Chalav Stam, not the Treifos. Got it

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  2. In the cholov Yisroel farms they remove the procedured cows that are Treif, In the Cholov Akum/Stam they do not remove them, therefore it is Cholov Treifah.

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  3. Who says that they remove the cows on Chalav Yisroel farms?

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    1. If your ignorant about this subject why do you post your ignorance? Find out if it’s true and you won’t have to post your shtus questions.

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  4. The farmers get paid a "nice-premium" for every procedured cow that is removed.
    We did check some of the Cholov Yisroel farms to verify.

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  5. The exclusive cholov yisroel farms do not remove them. The non exclusive cholov yisroel farms don’t use them and they leave them for the chloor stam/treifah

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  6. what halachic נאמנות is "nice-premium" based on? I dont remember that from סימן צח

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  7. How exactly did you *check* the cows

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  8. Can Yudel explain to me how he is מיישב the letter of Rav Moshe he quotes above, with what Rav Moshe printed in Igros Moshe regarding his היתר:

    וז״ל ולכן הרוצה לסמוך ולהקל יש לו טעם גדול ורשאי וכמו שמקילין בזה הרוב בנ״א שומרי תורה וגם הרבה רבנים וח״ו לומר שעושין שלא כדין וכו׳ מי שרוצה להקל הוא עושה כדינא

    It sounds like Rav Moshe thought his approach was permitted according to the Shulchan Aruch (כדינא)

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  9. Reb Moshe told Yudel and another yungerman that the teshuva was written for women and children that live in "merchakim" and cholov yisroel is not available only perhaps once in six months, but in lakewood that one can get cholov yisroel every week "it is OSSUR" end of quote from Reb Moshe.

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  10. Physically checked the ones that did not appear on the computer records.

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  11. So we are jumping from Treif milk which is the issue in this post to if stam Cholov, even if not treif, is OK.
    It is well known that Reb Moishe was not happy with Yeshivah leit using Cholov Stam. But we are trying to figure out how Reb Moishe Poskened on the Cholov Treif issue when the problem was discovered way after his Petira. We Know alot of of people are dreing with the Grubbeh finger, but we like to know the details of the dreing.

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  12. Reb Moshe addressed the Bloating treifah issue in YD 1 Siman 20 or 21.

    The DA's is clear in the Shulchan Oruch, that it's a Treifah, why does Reb Moshe have to address a halacha in shulchan oruch.
    Reb Moshe was asked to write a teshuvah that worms in the flesh of fish is muttar, he responded, I don't have to write a teshuvah on something that is clear in Shuchan Oruch.

    Reb Moshe never expected a R'Belsky or Cholov Treifah to appear on the scene.

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  13. Rav Moshe in YD is talking about bloat, not DA. Different body part of the animal. Yudel brush up on your Treifos.

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  14. The DA's were unknown to our community at that time, only bloating was known at that time.
    But a treifah is still a treifah and bottom line is the milk is cholov treifah.

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  15. Yes but it's inaccurate to quote Rav Moshe on this. You may as well quote Rav Chaim Ozer.

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  16. suspicious Rav Moshe meant it was just for women and children. He wasn't stupid, he should've wrote that.

    Also, if he writes that חלב סתם is ״כדינא״ that means for everyone. period.

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  17. The Tshuva was written to the person that asked. That person had very specific circumstances, which if you don't have all of those issues, the teshuva is not meant for you.

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  18. But Rav Moshe wrote in that Teshuva:

    וכמו שמקילין בזה הרוב בנ״א שומרי תורה וגם הרבה רבנים וח״ו לומר שעושין שלא כדין

    Yudel, you keep ignoring this

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    1. As he does many other Halachas.

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