Thursday, January 04, 2024

Update: Matzoh Bakeries are stopping to accommodate Chaburahs, as they don't send in advance WRITTEN INSTRUCTIONS & Only one person in charge!!!

Some of the Shmurah Matzah Bakeries are of the opinion that too many of the Chaburas, are well intentioned, but חבורה is a מכה הכתובה בתורה
HAND MATZOS- by Y. Shain- Y. Israel (Ed.) copies- kashrusy@aol.com
          In this short article, we will attempt to explain the various Minhagim, chumros and what to be on the lookout for when baking Hand Matzos.
          Wheat: For those concerned about Yoshon, ensure that the wheat is either winter wheat or planted enough time before Pesach, so that it has taken root before Pesach.
Besides having some verification of when it was planted, such as having a Mashgiach inspect the fields a few days before Pesach, some also utilize the records from the insurance company that granted the crop insurance.
In the past few years, there has been an issue with winter wheat; the gluten is very low, so some spring wheat is added in order to raise the gluten content. As Chasidim do not have a mesorah about Yoshon, they are generally less makpid about it. Nevertheless, one can certainly verify with their Hashgocha re: Yoshon.
 Harvesting time:
           Professional opinion differs concerning the ideal moisture content for harvesting. Ideally, it is best to harvest when the wheat is completely dry. (the drier the wheat, the better the flour). The issue is that once it’s אינו צריך לקרקע (does not require the ground anymore), should it rain, the moisture can theoretically create a chometz חמץ problem.
Wheat quality:
       Depending on the geographical location and the ground, wheat /flour will absorb water at a different ratio in one area compared to wheat planted elsewhere. It’s, therefore important to conduct actual comparative baking tests to ascertain which wheat (flour) source is more suitable.
Final Flour preparation:
       It’s quite common to combine whole-wheat (razoveh) flour together with white flour for taste & consistency purposes. Incidentally, this mixture also changes the ratio of absorption of the water. Some bakeries will mix the flour from different areas, which may pose a problem.
     Bakeries will usually be forthcoming with the source of the wheat (Arizona – California or elsewhere). It may be a reason for, concern however if the bakery refuses to share that information.
מים שלנו:
        There are various opinions concerning the time frame for drawing water from the well-מים שלנו. Note: Some bakeries use sink tap water for מים שלנו. There are valid differences of opinion in which shkiah time is used. If you have a strong opinion than it is best to ask BEFORE your appointment! (Some may be using Rabainu-Tam time).
Gloves:
       Some will want the kneader (aka “knaiter”) to wear non-powdered gloves or none. Some are concerned that the knetters’ hands may sweat, and should there be a hole in a glove, the accumulated sweat may escape through the hole into the flour or dough, so they don’t use gloves.
Some knetters’ hands were checked after they made multiple doughs, and although they wore gloves, their hands did not have any sweat.
Some change the bowls & gloves after every dough. Others will only change the bowl & gloves after the last dough of the 18 minutes or after every 4-6 doughs.
Other precautions:
     It’s important to visually and physically check the washed bowl to be certain that it is indeed completely dry.
There should be a vacuum by the knetter to pick up any loose flour in the air.
All the areas around the knetter’s area should be checked for residual flour especially around the windows & ledges of the person pouring in the water or the flour into, the knetter’ s mixing bowl.It is important to work with the driest possible dough, as is written by the חזון איש. Professional opinions are that a 42-45% water-to-flour ratio is ideal.
Some prefer to use wooden rolling pins while others prefer to use metal or aluminum rolling pins (easier to clean).
To have the dough workable & pliable to roll out, one must knead the dough very well, or as others use what’s called Finning. The “Finner” process consists of a heavy metal bar attached to a metal table on one side. The Finner bar is used to compress the dough, the dough is folded and compressed again & again by the Finner bar.
One should check the dough interior to ensure that there are no white specks of raw flour, [heard directly from Reb Yaakov Kamenetzky, Z”L]. When kneading by hand only, it’s more common to have white specks of flour in the dough. When finning is also used, usually there are less incidence of white specks.
The Finning process will increase the elasticity of the crumbly dough to make it workable. The longer it’s finned, the more pliable the dough will be and easier to work with to roll flat. The Finning tables should be constantly brushed off from the crumbs of flour accumulating even during the Finning process.
The knife used for the dividing of the dough log should be washed and/or cleaned on a constant basis. Others have it cleaned or changed in between every new log of dough.
After the dough is formed into a log by the Finning or the knetter, it’s passed to the person who will work the dough-log until he’s ready to divide the log into pre-determined pieces for the velgerers / rollers. There should be additional people working on those divided pieces of dough.
Some will roll on a marble or wooden table covered with paper, while others will work on metal tables.
By the way, the paper should be checked for starch as the paper does draw out some of the water from the dough.
The velgerers/rollers which should be more professional and experienced (such as may be often found at Chabura Matzoh baking), tend to press too hard on the dough when rolling/velgering as it raises the temperature of the dough by a few degrees. Therefore, it’s advisable only to use experienced rollers who coax the dough ,rather than press on the dough while rolling.
Some have a system that the same person who starts rolling out that piece of dough also finishes it to the proper size. Others use what’s called a “mas’chil and a gomer”, (a starter and a finisher).  Experience has shown that the second method is more efficient, albeit more boring.
The dough should be rolled out so that the edges and the center are the same thickness, not that there is a thicker rim. Velgering is serious business. If someone feels that the velgering is somewhat beyond his capabilities, he should not be embarrassed to request another position.
If any dough sticks to the table paper, there may be too much water in the dough or a wet day. On a wet day,, they may have to adjust or decrease the water in the dough.
The rolling pins should never be kept under the person’s arms or taken out of the room at any time. At the 18-minute breaks the rolling pins should not be washed with warm water, only with cool water, so they don’t get warm.
Some are more stringent than others in שהיות / lapses during the entire process. E.g. kneading, finning, dividing, rolling/velgerin, bringing it to reddler (perforator), reddler table, bringing to oven.  שיטת הרא"ש / Shitas Ha’Rosh is no lapses at all.

The holes in the Matzah are made by a multi-wheeled rotary perforator (reddler). There are two types of perforators: the narrow ones that have 4 to 6 wheels or the wider ones that have 10+ wheels and are of a heavier weight.
Some clean the wheels with a wire brush every 18 minutes, while others will also remove them at the end of the day and burn them out with a torch or put them into an oven.
The perforator (reddler), perforates the matzahs on a table that’s lined with paper. That paper should move on a constant basis because it tends to collect little pieces of dough from the perforator that gets stuck to the paper.
After the perforator completes his work, somebody puts the perforated matzahs on a stick that someone else takes to the oven. There should always be enough sticks, so you don’t have to reuse them, within 18 minutes, as they may still be warm.
In general, at the regular productions they put 5 to 8 matzos on the stick to take them to the oven. Some use unwrapped wooden sticks that require sanding down from the particles of dough that get stuck. Many have changed to paper-wrapped sticks. The paper should, be changed after every time it’s used to take matzos to the oven.
There should be a physical wall until the ceiling, between the oven area and the perforating area. There are sometimes fans near the divider wall or partition to keep the oven heat out of the perforating area. 
It takes a very long time for the oven floor to absorb the oven heat. It may take 2-3 days. Most bakeries a restoke the oven on Motzei Shabbos.
Some ask for תנור ראשון, the reason being that the oven was burned out from previous possibilities of kuh’fulois, chometz, etc. The other side of the coin is that sometimes the oven floor is not as hot as the oven's interior. Others will not want a Sunday morning baking because of that concern. 
The one putting the matzahs into the oven is called the “shibber”. Depending on the width of the oven, they usually work with 2-4 rows of matzahs in the oven. Some use 2 shibbers, one to put in and one to take out. It’s more efficient to use 2 shibbers when possible.
It’s a fact that heat of the oven absorbs the water faster than the flour. It is, therefore,, important to work with the driest possible dough, as is written by the חזון איש.
Most commercial bakery ovens operate at 1100°F or above. Therefore, a dough that has a higher ratio of water will seem to be completely baked on the outside נקרמו פניה, when in fact, the inside is still not completely baked. When the matzo cools partially and feels hard, it was “dried” “not baked”.
.”Therefore, working with a very dry and crumbly dough is advantageous. It’s also important to have equal heat on both the oven floor and interior. (When making a pita dough, the heat draws the top of the dough, forming a pocket in the pita).
When matzah dough is put into the oven, it usually rises like a yarmulke and then settles down flat onto the oven. It will remain raised if the interior temperature exceeds the floor temperature.
The top of the matzah will have the proper color, while the bottom of the matzah will be dark around the rim that was sitting on the hot stone floor of the oven. The bottom of the matzo will be whitish, because it was getting baked from reflected heat and not from stone contact temperature.
The oven's interior towards the back wall is hotter than the front. Therefore, the further to the back the matzahs are in the oven, the quicker they get baked. The shibbers will usually start removing them back to front.
Some shibbers will move around the matzahs in the oven or put them near the door to finish baking. Another object is not to have matzahs moved around in the oven and to put them by the door.  Some very experienced individuals will feel the matzo as soon as it comes out of the oven to determine if the softness / pliable is from the heat or a not fully baked matzo. They should wear thick gloves as the matzos at that moment are very hot.
After the matzos are removed from the oven by the shibbers, they are put onto a table or basket to cool and sent to the packing room. Some will line the basket with a fresh cloth. Some check for kuh’fulois (folds), or soft matzos etc. at that point, immediately after coming out of the oven.
Counting 18 minutes
time frameThe 18-minute matzah baking time-frame begins when the water is poured into the flour and ends when the last matzos are put in or removed from the oven.  Alert: unbeknownst to consumers, some bakeries go until 22 minutes!
Hand matzos are of various thicknesses and different diameters. The range is from 6-7 matzos per lb. up to 10-11 matzos per lb. The more matzos to the lb. the thinner (and smaller) the matzos are.
To determine the real price of the matzos, it’s not a per pound price to consider but the per matzo price.
CHABURAH MATZOS: Chaburah Matzos should be made only in a bakery that has in place a relatively good system for their non-Chaburah matzos.
The Chaburah should improve (not hinder) the system by bringing sufficient individuals to do certain chores,
Mayim She’lunu- which shkiah; 
Goal is a dry crumbly dough,
Timing issues;
18 minutes maximum from putting in water until removed from oven, how often the bowls (and gloves) get changed? 
How long is the kneading or finning, cleaning off the finning tables & bars constantly, working the dough pieces by the divider, cleaning the divider knife; cleaning all crumbs from velgerers table, rolling pins should not be put under arm, washed with cool water, reddler wheels burned out, no matzah dough waits by velgerers, no matzah dough waits by the reddler, no waiting for matzahs to put onto stick that takes to oven, etc.
Paper/wrapped sticks, enough sticks available, so they don’t have to reuse any stick within the 18 minutes.
All Shitas Ha’Rosh, no sh-hiyas at all.
‘Ra”shi’ (רש"י) -flour is hand ground flour as opposed to רחיים של מכונה. (machine-ground flour).
Therefore it's recommended that everyone in your group arrives at the bakery at least 1/2 hour prior to your appointment to have enough time to get washed up and dressed and to become familiar with the operation. 

There should be only one person in charge of speaking to the head Mashgiach or Manager. That individual should ideally have many years of experience in baking hand matzos and be thoroughly familiar with the practical halochos.

On does not become a master matzoh maker/baker by just reading the above. It is merely our intention to educate the interested reader of the many intricacies involved in this very worthwhile and satisfying endeavor.

35 comments:

Anonymous said...

This is an excellent article.Its accurate, and written by someone who clearly knows first hand. I will add , it's critical to have someone in the packing room to mark your boxes. Mixups can happen. And remember to enjoy the opportunity to Serve Hashem !

Anonymous said...

Is there any Matzo bakery that follows these rules/hints?

Anonymous said...

Half of these things are pseudo chumros, fabricated non halachic issues. Vacuum near the kneiter?! The main rule is, learn the halachos well. Don't listen to the 'oilam' and certainly not amhaaratzim who invent chumros for a living.

Anonymous said...

If the matzos are thin one MUST more matzoh then if the are thicker.
The shiur of matzah if you use volume - a bit hard to determine exact volume (air pockets) - or you use weight - easy to get exact weight (possibly one must weigh before Yom Tov ask LOR).
Thus the important part of the pricing is per pound not per matzah. In other words per shiur not per matzah.
If you using this matzah for matzah Brie (whatever that is) then you go per matzah.
However, most if not all chaburah people don’t “bruk” so the per matzah price is frivolous.

Asiatisher Marmorosher Ferd said...

"Half of these things are pseudo chumros"

Dach zich that was Burich Teitelbaum's rationale when he said oh the heck with it ALL, and ran an entire operation one year via Romanisher shiksas. No pesky mashgichim and no yeshivishe or heimishe drey kops. In addition, any frocks looking for photo ops were directed to Lakewood.

Anonymous said...

Usually, one likes to eat a whole matzah or a half at a meal, so the more matzas per pound, that's how you realistically look at the price of one's matzas.

Usually those thicker matzas have more water in them, so are paying for water at the price of flour, just imagine by "Rashi" matzas.

Anonymous said...

What a heicheh timtzah how one can be yoitzay mitzvas matzah with water.

Anonymous said...

Do those same people usually eat one thin piece of fish. Or one thin piece of meat along with the one thin matzah ??

BIG Doctor said...

"Mixups can happen"

They've even happened nebich with newborn babies in the hospital maternity ward.

Anonymous said...

How about the taking off Challah? In a very famous bakery it was revealed that a woman was taking off Challah after the matzo was baked, and was also sorting the Matzos to determine which were good and which were not.

There was zero sign of any Mashgiach there, and the woman had absolutely no clue about what she was doing.

Anonymous said...

And what makes so sure that Mashgiach knows any better.
They all take off chalah after it's baked, besides by machine matzas.

Anonymous said...

It’s a fact that heat of the oven absorbs the water faster than the flour. It is, therefore,, important to work with the driest possible dough

What does it mean the heat absorbs the flour?
And why is this a reason for using a drier dough?

Anonymous said...

Because the water absorbs the heat faster, you will have the matzah become the color of a baked matzah נקרמו פניה much before it's internally baked.
By the time it cools enough for one to examine the matzah for softness, it "dried internally".
So you don't have a fully baked matzah per se.
The Chazon Ish says it should be as dry as possible.

Anonymous said...

Mon Jan 30, 09:02:00 AM 2023.

Why is the women part mentioned ? It could of been a man just as well. In fact if you do not trust women you can't eat in your own house or be married.

Anonymous said...

Mon Jan 30, 09:24:00 AM 2023

One can NOT take off challah from the dough when baking for pesach.
Did you ever study the simple version of hilchos peasach ??

Anonymous said...

Thank you
Won't the hotter water heat up the rest of the dough? And how does the water make it brown outside, isn't it the dough becoming brown?

Anonymous said...

That is the fact that the excess water draws the heat, and the mallard reaction will make the matzah look like it's fully baked when only the exterior is baked, then the interior "dries" after it's out of the oven.

Anonymous said...

Does the drying outside the oven make it chametz in any way ??
How come Halacha does not address this ? (until some recent chumras seekers maybe discovered some late achronim about this) ?
I’m not saying their wrong just trying to figure out what they did 100 years ago.

Anonymous said...

That's why the Chazon Ish said a "very dry" dough.
Likely they all used dry dough, but the commercial producers need production, and it's very easy to roll out wet dough.

Anonymous said...

If everyone in the old days used “very dry dough” then the Chazoin Ish was not mechadesh anything.
Take it from there.

Anonymous said...

Everyone used dough that was on the drier side, the Chazon Ish said it should be very dry.

Anonymous said...

Today all use dough on “ the drier side “ as well. But how much is it leaning to dry side.

Anonymous said...

The hand matzo bakeries are not using a dry dough at all; they are using over 50% water.
The ones that do finning, use a dough a little drier than the non-finner bakeries, the finning adds to the elasticity of the dough, so it's easier to roll with less water. The longer the finning, the less water one could use.
The machine matzos are using a dry dough.

Anonymous said...

Wed Feb 01, 05:33:00 AM 2023

So is it a chumrah to use machine matzahs since its nice and dry AND push the Chazon ish name to it as well ??

Anonymous said...

Machine Matzohs, No way, as there are very serious issues, the possibility of bordering on chometz.

So don't think if you have one ingredient in the process that's good, then the entire product becomes somehow acceptable.

Take kosher cholov yisroel milk, cook Solomons bet yosef in it, it's as treif as it can get.

Anonymous said...

If one uses cholov stam or cholov treif as it is known on this site and cook it with Aron’s stuff you possibly can be off the hook. Not in reality but in theory..

Line of Frocks waiting to get in said...

Lakewood matzos bakery should have drier dough with all the photo op camera flashes going off that generate heat to evaporate liquid.

Chabadsker said...

"Lakewood matzos bakery should have drier dough"

Does that also apply to the chometzdik rejects available for the bargain preizen?

Anonymous said...

The same Reb Aron who Kelopish put Horav Yudel on the Lakewood map has his Einiklach Roshay Yeshivos baking Matzos at Lakewood Matzah Bakery. Interesting. Unless they only use it for the last day.

Anonymous said...

All of the Roshei Yeshiva and Lakewood "shvitzers" use Lakewood Matzah Bakery because of the picture that goes into the media.

It's a show & tell operation, bring the kids and of course the אינו יודע

Anonymous said...

So you saying it’s not even real matzah. Plastic matzah. Which every koovid zeecheh plays with.
Do they give you instructions how it looks best on the pics??

Anonymous said...

Can anyone relay to the Lakewood Matzoh bakery that any and all matzah rejected or left over should please be delivered to Bloomies on Leffers and mark it For CCRC only.

Tizku lemzvot harbeh.

Anonymous said...

Sounds like you need a Doctorate in Baking in order to bake chabooreh matzos.
Chabooreh matzos used to mean you go down yourself and sweat while baking your own matzah with your own chumrehs. Not with all Yudel chimrehs that he collected from here and there over the years.

Anonymous said...

Thu Jan 04, 10:12:00 PM 2024 is taking all the fun out of it!

Anonymous said...

Excuse me.
This site is no fun site.
Its a series site.
VERY serious series.