Wednesday, January 09, 2019

Making an affair, Wedding, Bar-Mitzvah

Dear Rabbi Shain,

I just married off my last child and am very happy. The problem that I have was and still is the catering hall. and the Rav Hamachshir.

The chosen's parents insisted on this hall and we did not object. I asked the caterer for the phone number of the Rav Hamachshir. Six weeks later, I asked, again for the phone number. A few days later, the Rav Hamachshir called me back and left a message on my phone. He said that he cannot talk, it was erev Shabbat and he would not be answering the phone number. I finally touched base with him the next week.
 
The place the chosen's parents chose was a treif place that had a kosher caterer in it. I told the Rav Hamachshir that I am not comfortable with him using treif glasses in a Kosher establishment. I wanted new glasses for my simcha. He cited me the Shulchan Aruch, about the difference of opinions between the Rama and the Mechaber. I told him that I am not Sephardi and I hold from two sets of glasses in my house. He told me that there are many poskim that hold from using glass for both and he ridiculed me for not listening to them. I reminded him of the g'morra in Chulin that prohibits someone for making fun of someone because he holds from a certain halachic position.

I told him that I cannot hold by a catering hall that has less standards than my own house. I will never bring in a treif or milchig glass and put it into a soapy basin with meat dishes, or put it into a dishwasher with fleishic dishes, like he does. He refused to listen. Afterwards, he called the caterer. The caterer then called my wife and told her that I or anyone else was not allowed in the kitchen.

I spoke to my Rav. He called up the place and spoke to them. The owner refused to budge and told my Rav, flat out, that no one goes into the kitchen and that 'either you trust the Kashrus or you don't'. 

I spoke to a number of other Rabbonim afterwards. I am fully aware that the soap in the dishwasher makes in pagum and there might be a heter to use it, but none of the Rabbonim that I told would do the same things in their house. All the Rabbonim that I spoke to left after the Chupa, after telling me previously that they would stay until after Sheva Berachot. I could not tell the guests what I did, relying of different psak halachot, but I did not eat anything at the wedding - I brought my own food, drink and cups. I did not want to stop the chaseneh.

I spoke to the Maitre d during the affair and asked to see the mashgiach. He refused.

I am heartbroken at what happened. The Rav Hamachshir is a tremendous name and the hall is a well known hall. I was there many times previously, based on the name of the Rav Hamachshir but personally witnessed multiple affairs happening there, both Kosher and treif, at the same time. Never did I think that they used the same cups.

People have to know that  places that are treif should not have a Kosher caterer, unless there are separate glasses, at the very minimum. If they are really smart, they should insist to use only Kosher caterers.

I had a conversation with the Rav Hamachshir a few years ago he probably does not remember it. . He claimed that he only bought items that he personally checked out, and it has a chassidic or heimishe hechsher. I asked him about Coca Cola. He started yelling at me, saying that I was not allowed to ask that or question what he does.

How much worse is it?


14 comments:

Anonymous said...

It's one thing if you are talking about hot drinks, but cold?

Anonymous said...

All this is worthless without names. I can make up any stories I want also.

J Hill said...

Would you take a cold glass that still had some chocolate milk in it and wash it in the same basin that has meat dishes in it? Using the same dishwater and possibly the same sponges?

What about putting it into the dishwasher, together with some treif sherry and let the hot water be recycled over and over again, washing it the same time you wash your dishes?

If done accidently, you might claim batul b'shishim, but you did it on purpose.

Anonymous said...

this is a fake letter. Years ago I worked in a catering facility and I can prove that this is a fake letter. however if i were to do that then "fakers" would know how to avoid showing their false intentions.

Anonymous said...

Fake letter, you worked in a catering facility....
perhaps U R part of the problem as well?

What else is your experience?

I'm afraid to hear.

Did you work in a kosher facility?

Anonymous said...

Reb Yudel knows the name of the place and the Rav Hamachshir. I wrote the letter and I did not want to be Motze Shem Rah.
How many places in the New York that operate Kosher and Treif in the same establishment? And have a private hechsher and not a national hechsher? Now is the time to call them out for the horrible things that they do!!

Please - let me see your 'proof' that it a fake letter......

Yudel Shain said...

"All this is worthless without names. I can make up any stories I want also."

If this were an isolated case - Halachah will warrant l'toeles warning
the public, and it would be proper and necessary to give the exact
name and details. Unfortunately this particular case is a-typical of
any (or at least of most) facilities which deal with non-kosher food.
Thus; as a test case, it is Halachically not necessary to give the
exact names involved.

H-shem yigdor pirtzoseinu. With great sadness I just found out about
the petira of R. Herman zatza"l.

Yehi Zichro Baruch.

Anonymous said...

You seem to be referring to an situation with an exclusive kosher caterer with a private hechsher. Very few establishments with that setup have the ability to have multiple events at the same time. On Long Island that place changed to the OU a while ago. The place in the Bronx can't host multiple affairs at once.

Anonymous said...

The place in the Bronx has hosted multiple events. I was at a choseneh there and during the meal, the room where the couple got married was rented out to traif event.

Anonymous said...

The place in the Bronx has a separate Kosher only Kitchen. Surprise Surprise Surprise.
The Mashgiach over there is the dream of every Rav Hamachshir. You could not pull anything by him even if you hired a pro.

Mendel Shemtov said...

The place in the Bronx fits all of the descriptions. Marina Del Rey, operated by the same people who operate Chop A Nosh has R' Yaakov Reisman, who is arrogant and unknowledgeable on how to pasken a shylah. He does, however, say that Aguda does everything that he does. If Aguda ever knew that he allows treif glasses to be washed the same time and place as the 'kosher' china and flatware, they would disassociate themselves from him. All he knows is how to assur other hashgachot. This place should be avoided at all costs.

As for having multiple affairs - Marina is too small, but can accomodate another affair in the chupa room. also - the rooms for the chossen and kallah have treif chafing dishes in there, usually dirty from other affairs.

Anonymous said...

Shemtov needs a gift Quickly.

A Chofetz Chayim - shmiras Haloshon.

Anonymous said...

Anonymous said...
The place in the Bronx has a separate Kosher only Kitchen. Surprise Surprise Surprise.
The Mashgiach over there is the dream of every Rav Hamachshir. You could not pull anything by him even if you hired a pro.

Wed Jan 16, 11:14:00 AM 2019

I don't understand what you are saying. The kitchen might be kosher, but they use the same glasses that the treif use. They wash them at the same time that that they wash the china there. The Rav Hamachshir admitted it. Would you do that in your house? Why force me to do it when I go to your house?

As for the mashgiach - if you read the original letter, the baal hasimcha wanted to see the mashgiach. The mashgiach refused to see him. Is that the dream of the Rav Hamachshir or a nightmare? I never heard of a mashgiach refusing to meet with people who had questions. What were they hiding?

Anonymous said...

Someone has a treif place, supposedly called 'glatt' and we should be quiet about it? Why? Everyone has to know what is kosher and who is a phony!!

What else does the 'rav hamachshir' supervise? Where else should heimeshe people not go to?